Dubroff’s Diner

Diner Question: Which veterans deserve to get into the Hall of Fame?

Earlier, this week, the Hall of Fame announced 10 finalists for consideration in the “Today’s Game” era. Seven of the 10 have played for the Orioles, and one, Davey Johnson, played and managed the team.

Harold Baines, Albert Belle, Joe Carter, Will Clark, Lou Piniella and Lee Smith are the others who’ve played for the Orioles.

Orel Hershiser, Charlie Manuel and George Steinbrenner are the non-Oriole candidates.

Smith, who played only for the Orioles in the strike-shortened 1994 season, seems to have the best chance to gain election. For enshrinement, support of 12 of the 16 Veterans committee members is needed.

In his 15 years on the Baseball Writers of America Association ballot, Smith attracted 50.6 percent of the vote in 2012. Seventy-five percent is needed for election.

Johnson and Piniella are up for consideration as managers and Steinbrenner is the only owner on the ballot.

Besides Smith, who had 478 career saves, Piniella, who’s 16th on the all-time managers win list and Steinbrenner seem to have the best chance.

This isn’t the BBWAA Hall of Fame ballot, which we’ll talk about in further detail when it’s released in a few weeks.

This Week’s Diner Question:  Which candidates for the Hall of Fame among these 10 would you vote for?

Make sure to look for a special letter to Orioles fans from Buck Showalter on BaltimoreBaseball.com on Friday.

Rich Dubroff

Rich Dubroff grew up in Brooklyn as a fan of New York teams, but after he moved to Baltimore, quickly adopted the Orioles and Colts. After nearly two decades as a freelancer assisting on Orioles coverage for several outlets, principally The Capital in Annapolis and The Carroll County Times, Dubroff began covering the team fulltime in 2011. He spent five years at Comcast SportsNet’s website and for the last two seasons, wrote for PressBoxonline.com, Dubroff lives in Baltimore with his wife of more than 30 years, Susan.

View Comments

  • Rich, I'm sure that everyone around here will disagree with me, but frankly, I have a hard time putting ANY of these guys into the same conversation as Willie Mays, Babe Ruth and Red Ruffing.

    • Boog, most times the Veterans Committees don’t elect anyone. Last year was an exception with Jack Morris and Alan Trammell. I think Smith has the best chance because of his previous strong showings in the BBWAA vote.

  • "Make sure and look ..."
    It's "to look." Just like it's "try to," not "try and," which you frequently use.
    You're welcome.

  • Rich - do players now have 3 ways to get into the Hall - the annual BBWAA ballot, the “Today’s Era” ballot and the Veterans Committee? I agree Smith might be the best of this group, but if he couldn’t muster more than 50% on the regular ballot why is he deserving here? And Steinbrenner??? - he was kicked out of baseball for a year and used his wealth and power to minimize competition. He might belong in the Hall of Shame, but not in the Hall of Fame. I’m with Boog - nobody on this list should make it.

    • Tx, there are two ways, the BBWAA and four Veterans Committees. There are committees not only for “Today’s Game,” which considers players from 1988 to the present, “Modern Baseball” from 1970-87, “Golden Days” from 1950-69 and “Early Baseball,” prior to 1950.

      Last year, the Modern Baseball committee elected Jack Morris and Alan Trammell.

      It’s entirely possible that none make it, but it’s a system the Hall of Fame set up so that players overlooked by the writers can be reconsidered.

  • Harold baines had some very good career numbers, I am pretty sure that if he played in the field most of his career he would be knocking on the door to the Hall
    I think Lee Smith should get in, I think he was the all time saves leader for a while.
    And why isn't Mike Devereaux on this list?

    • Devo, your namesake has just about 1,900 fewer lifetime hits than Baines does.

      Smith was the all-time saves leader, but he was surpassed by Trevor Hoffman and Mariano Rivera.

  • I am in agreement that none of these candidates is HOF worthy. My personal favorite, though, is Harold Baines, fellow Marylander. His numbers fell short (2868 hits, 386 hrs, .289) and his WAR was only 38 (Cal was 96, Eddie 66), which surprised me a bit. He hit .301 as an Oriole, the highest of his 5 teams. He was a great hitter, and right fielder for the Chisox, before knee injuries.

  • Steinbrenner is the only one of the ten who should be voted to the HOF. He significantly changed the level of competition among teams and significantly increased the value of franchises .

    • Olney, his investment into the Yankees was small and the return enormous. But, it's not owners voting.

  • The fact that I am from Harold Baines hometown and he is still a revered figure there mandates I demand his inclusion. Talbot county loyalties aside, I don't see a Hall of Famer on this list.

    Was anyone else surprised at Joe Carter not being a stronger candidate? Growing up, it just seemed like he was a superstar when he was with Toronto and Cleveland, then looking back not so much. Not that it matters, they'll be replaying "Touch 'em all Joe" for 100 years, so Carter is in the Hall even if he isn't in the Hall (same thing with Hersheiser).

    • Bancells, I'll think of you the next time I'm at the "Crab Claw" in St. Michael's.

      Carter's career WAR was just 19.6, his batting average .259 and on-base percentage just .306. None of those numbers is Hall-worthy.

      Yes, he hit one of the most famous home runs in postseason history, but that's not good enough.

      An excellent player, but not a Hall of Famer.

      Hershiser has a much better case. His WAR is 56.3, and his stats are similar to Catfish Hunter, another Hall of Famer.

  • Since this is the veterans committee, the standards to get in the hall are lowered just a little. I see multiple people getting in and a few toss ups. As much as we all hate him, I see the Boss going in. He was just too big of a figure not to be in the hall. Also, I see both managers making it. Both had good win percentages (548 Manuel and 517 Pinella). Also, Manuel has a ring and Pinella has three. One could make a decent case for Clark and baines. Clark's +300 lifetime average make him more likely than Baines who doesn't have one of those "magic" stats. As for Herscheiser and smith, neither will make it. Herscheiser's 3.5 era and the fact that smith was a reliever will keep them both out.

    • BirdsCaps, both Charlie Manuel and Lou Piniella have a ring. Davey Johnson is also under consideration as a manager, and he has one, too.

      Will Clark's WAR is 56.5, which is pretty good. His .384 OBP is quite good, but he seems to fall a little short.

      Smith's chance comes because he had real support from the BBWAA, unlike the others.

      The committee is comprised of writers, former players and executives.

  • Man you are digging the bottom of the barrel for content here IMO.

    How about an article on the pro's and con's or advancing players through the minors and up to the MLB faster than normal?

    • jkneps, thank you for your comment. We are all waiting for the Orioles to name a new baseball management team, and when they do, there will be lots of different things to write about.

      I've always found the Hall of Fame, especially when it involves former Orioles to be of interest to many fans.

      I'll keep your suggestion in mind.

      • Thanks Rick for keeping the suggestion in mind! Seems like a thorough discussion of benefits and drawbacks of progressing minor league players at normal and accelerated rates would be very pertinent.

        I've been to Cooperstown three times and love the Hall of Fame, just not too enthused about players getting in via the various veterans committees, ex-Oriole or not.

Share
Published by
Rich Dubroff

Recent Posts

  • Minors

With Basallo’s big league debut nearing, Orioles’ international program showing strength

The Orioles haven’t signed a player from the Dominican Republic who played for them since…

December 23, 2024
  • Peter Schmuck

Peter Schmuck: A Corbin Burnes cautionary tale

Way back at the turn of this century, a venture capital guy named Tom Hicks,…

December 22, 2024
  • Minors

Orioles stocking up on players with major league experience for camp invites

While the signings of players with major league experience to minor league contracts might not…

December 21, 2024
  • Midday Mailbag

Should Orioles sign Scherzer and Verlander? | MAILBAG

Question: Why wouldn't the O's grab both Max Scherzer and Justin Verlander since they could…

December 20, 2024
  • Rich Dubroff

Japanese right-hander Tomoyuki Sugano explains his decision to join Orioles and what he expects

Tomoyuki Sugano, the 35-year-old Japanese right-hander who signed with the Orioles on Monday, appeared on…

December 20, 2024
  • Midday Mailbag

Can Sugano’s addition help Orioles sign Sasaki? | MAILBAG

Question: With the signing of Tomoyuki Sugano, it seems that if you prefer a smaller…

December 19, 2024