Minor Monday: DL Hall hopes to deliver in Bowie on the way to Baltimore

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• Can’t wait to see that battery in B’more, wouldn’t mind seeing Buck II either, go O’s...

• Sounds promising. Let’s hope they both put all the pieces together faster than expected. Looking forward to seeing these guys in action!

• With Hall and Rodriguez they orioles might have actually some elite pitching. Duquette will get the credit for drafting them but let’s be honest does anyone think he would’ve actually done anything to develop them. After seeing Rodriguez this weekend as the ironbirds played the blue rocks he towers over everyone. It can not be a fun at bat against him. If hall is making adjustments now under Elias then why didn’t he make adjustments under Duquette. The minor leaguers as a whole seem to have made adjustments and been developed under Elias then under duquette. I can’t name one player that the previous regime has developed. Elias has a plan outlined for these kids and it seems to be working.

  • I think there's a decent enough chance they would have developed under Duquette. These guys have talent. So are you implying that Elias personally suggested DL's adjustments?

    Let's face it, Duquette's and Elias' charge from ownership were and are quite different.

    Dan was expected to win, and win now. He pretty much came in to a built-to-win team. His talent lied in player acquisition on the cheap. And he did win. And he did acquire talent on the cheap. Nowadays it's much different because nobody cares if Elias wins game now, except maybe myself and a few others around here that abhor tanking. Elias would like us to think that his talent lies in organizational management. And I certainly hope it does because I haven't seen anything else positive for 3 years now! The man is a sharp cookie ... no doubt about it. But let's win a few games this year 'eh?

    But I digress ... Let's face it, the cupboard wasn't left nearly has bare as some around here would like to believe, and yes, I believe these guys would have progressed under Duquette or ANYBODY else for that matter. They have the talent to.

    All that being said, I'm all for Elias turning this thing around, I really am. But let's do it already! I'm not ready to anoint the guy the savior until he does.

    Drink Pepsi

    • In fairness, the Orioles really haven't had "3 years" under Elias ... they had a full season in 2019, 60 games last year (with no opportunity for minor league development), and 34 games this year ... more like 1.5 seasons, so far.

      And while you're correct that Duquette was operating under "win now" pressure from Peter Angelos, its also true that Duquette had a much bigger payroll to work with, whereas under Elias, ownership has cut payroll to bone.

      • Noted on the 3 years and the payroll disparities. However, if you look at the numbers, the Orioles were decidedly middle of the pack in MLB payroll-wise during the Duquette years. In those 8 years, the average payroll ranking out of 30 teams was 15.3 The highest they ever ranked was #10 and they finished in the dead middle or lower have during 6 of those 8 years.

        He wasn't exactly able to buy top shelf free agents now was he?

        And yes ...Mike has NO budget. Or at least if he does, it's been directed elsewhere.

        God bless Miike Elias. How's that?

        • That sounds fair.

    • Ok but the dodgers are in win now mode and develop talent like a rebuilding team. So they orioles could have had drafted good while winning and didn’t. Hall slipped to them due to signability concerns. Duquette did not develop bundy or gausman. I’m not saying Elias suggested the adjustments but I’m sure the development team looked at the tape and made suggestions as to how he can improve things like his command. Things Duquette and them never did. They did not develop talent at all. Gausman was a top prospect with talent and he did not develop with the orioles. You look at a team like the dodgers the develop guys that were drafted in like the eleventh round.

      • So if (god forbid) Rodriguez or Wells blow out their elbow and has Tommy John ... as Bubdy did ....does that qualify as 'failing to develop the player.'

        And Gausman was never ever as highly touted as Rodriguez or Wells. Don't give me that BS.

        And yeah, the Dodgers have a top shelf minor league system and scouting department. I never called that a strong suit of Duquette's did I? I stated that he found talent on the cheap via FA or trade .. guys like (and forgive me spelling ahead of time ...

        Wei Yi Chen, Nelson Cruz, Delmon Young ,Koji Uehara ,JJ Hardy ,Chris Davis (don't laugh, he had several great years), Jeremy Guthrie ,Miguel Gonzalez .... and I'm sure quite a few more, I can't think of them all.

        He didn't build a farm system ... I never said he did.

        Believe me when I say that I hope as much as ANYONE ELSE here that Mr. Elias builds a great farm system...one the team can afford over time.

        • Ken, Jeremy Guthrie was acquired by Andy MacPhail traded by Duquette two months after he took over for Jason Hammel and Matt Lindstrom. Koji Uehara was also signed by MacPhail and traded by him to Texas for Chris Davis and Tommy Hunter. MacPhail also traded for J.J. Hardy.

          He did sign Chen, arguably his best signing, Cruz, Young and Gonzalez.

          Gausman was the overall fourth pick. The reason he wasn't as publicized as Hall and Rodriguez was that by the time he was drafted, the team began winning. Fans focus on the major league team when it's winning, and when it's not, they look to the minors for hope.

  • Oh my! Let's see what the statistics say, shall we?
    In 2018, DL Hall pitched 94 1/3 innings at A DelMarVa with an ERA of 2.96, WHIP 1.166, and career minor league low of 4.0 BB/9 innings.
    In 2018, Grayson Rodriguez only pitched 19 1/3 innings for the Orioles Rookie/Gulf Coast League with an ERA of 2.79, 1.241 WHIP, and career minor league low 3.3 BB/9 innings.
    Looks like Duquette did a pretty darn good job of developing both Hall and Rodriguez in 2018. You Orioles20 win today's negative nonsense comment! Congrats!

    • While they did do good under duquette I believe Elias took their development to the next level by using rapsoda and biomechanics.

    • If you're being sarcastic, let me clue you in ... sarcasm doesn't work very well in print. Otherwise .. you make no sense.

      And how exactly was I being negative with that comment? Because I said I don't like tanking?

      • My comment was supposed to be in reply to Orioles20 comment. It ended up being in reply to no one. The last two sentences are "You Orioles20 win today’s negative nonsense comment! Congrats!" I did not say you BRR were being negative and apologize for the confusion, I will be more careful where I put my replies in the future to avoid confusion. Plus I am going for this new positive vibe!

  • how could you not remember John Means

• Overall the pitching on the farm has been fantastic other than some hiccups with sedlock, wells, etc. Norfolk hasnt been quite as stellar as some of the other teams but they’ve been hurt with injuries (Baumann) and taxi squad players. They will settle down I think.

• Yesterday’s game is another example of quick hook Hyde . How can you expect to get the youngsters to grow and learn how to pitch out of jams if you don’t give them the opportunity to do so in a season in which you are just playing the games and not competing for a playoff spot.

  Time for Stewart to go he can’t help you if he is in the training room and really what has he shown you ?

  I think it’s now the time to bring up Martin and Jones and see what you have or at least Martin I believe part of the problem with Mountcastle is there is nothing and I do mean nothing hitting behind him .

  • Come on man! DJ Stewart had a 0.809 OPS in 2020 over 112 PAs. That's what he has really shown us all...

  • I know I’m just an old name who is not into all the analytics of today’s game and the example of DJ Stewart’s 0,809 OPS is a classic reason why. If memory serves me correctly he was hitless for about his first 15 ABs or so, had an incredible hot streak, then didn’t do much of anything else after that. I’m sure even he would say he didn’t have a good year. These OPS numbers can really be skewed, especially when it’s only a little over 100 ABs. I don’t think he’s good defensively either. He’s a decent major league player who would be a fourth outfielder for a lot of teams but if he’s a starting outfielder for the O’s then they’ve got big problems.

• Do the O's have a promising shortstop or second baseman in the minors?

  • Adam Hall in Aberdeen had a good 2019 playing so and 2nd base at Delmarva . I think he is better playing 2nd

  • Jahmai Jones 2B Norfolk has had good batting stats recently with OPS of 0.886 2019 Fall League Arizona, 0.857 OPS in only 7 PAs with Angels in 2020, and 0.924 OPS over 6 games/27 PAs at Norfolk in 2021.

    Richie Martin SS Norfolk also had good batting stats finishing 2019 strong with a 1.055 OPS over 31 PAs in Sep 2019. His OPS at Norfolk 2021 is 0.667 over 6 games/27 PAs.

    • How do those OPS's compare to Urias'?
      ;)

  • Lol...stir the pot, love it....go O’s...

  • I’m hearing really good things about Gunnar Henderson at SS but I think he’s only 19 and at A ball. But I’d keep my eye on him.

• Grow the arms, buy the bats

• Seems we've had our hopes up about the young "up n coming" arms for at at least 20 years now only to be disappointed so I'll guard my enthusiasm. That being said with new developmental tactics these days and names like Hall,Rodriguez,Baumann we may have an end to our wait.

• DL Hall's 2 walks over 4 1/3 inning converts to 4.16 walks per innings, better than his 5.1 per 9 innings but still higher than MLB average of 3.4 this season.

• Minors position player watch: BA / OPS / Ks divided by ABs

  AAA:
  Cumberland 0.200 / 0.650 / 0.333
  Diaz 0.200 / 0.582 / 0.280
  Jones 0.227 / 0.924 / 0.182
  Martin 0.250 / 0.667 / 0.167

  AA
  Rutschman 0.190 / 0.701 / 0,360 (5G, 25PA)
  Patrick Dorrian 2B/3B/SS 24y-318d 0.333 / 1.446 / 0.176 (4G, 17PA) obtained from the Pirates (6/26/2019) as player to be named, Orioles sent RHP Yefry Ramirez to the Pirates 5/27/2019

  • Are you a real human or robot

  • Sorry I'm an old fart. Those stats are pig-Latin to me. Give me W/L,ERA for pitchers and BA,RBIs and HRs for hitters.

  • Agree

  • Old fart as well, baseball knowledge tells me more than all the crazy stats...who really needs to know who bats better against someone during a full moon or Mercury retrograde...LMAO...go O’s...

  • Ray, Bruce and Orial,

    We try to cover baseball accurately, and while you may care for some of the newer stats that we use, they’re used by the Orioles and other teams, so we’re doing a disservice to you, the reader if we ignore or belittle them.

    OPS, which I often used, is displayed on the scoreboard along with batting average at Camden Yards, and it's an important stat because it combines on-base percentage with slugging average.

    WHIP, another good stat, combines walks and hits with innings pitched.

    Those stats should enhance your enjoyment of the game. We try not to bury you in new stats, but those in analytic departments in baseball tend to discount what are called the counting stats.

    I still use them because many people can relate to them, but they don't tell the whole story. Take Saturday night's game. Matt Harvey was charged with an error and four runs scored as a result. Because the pitcher is considered a fielder, a rule that I think is silly, the runs were unearned and his ERA actually fell.

    Starting pitchers often don't stay in a game long enough to be involved with the decision, so other stats are needed.

    If a player gets lots of singles, but doesn't hit for power or walk, he may have a high batting average, but won't have a high OPS.

    Ray, when you were coaching wrestling, I'll bet you would have loved to have used analytics because they would have made you even a better coach than what you were. Of course, your knowledge of your sport and your experience in it made you an excellent coach. But, if you had a mathematical tool to measure a wrestler's effectiveness, that would have been great.

    So, let's not make fun of advanced stats and those who use them. I remember when people used to brag about their lack of computer skills. You don't hear that very much these days.

    • I follow the Braves as well as the O's. I assume they use analytics but their announcers (and articles) never talk about any advanced
      metrics. They say how hard HR's were hit but that is about it.

      But they win.(#3 straight division titles) so they don't have to talk constantly about analytics, do they?

      • All teams use analytics now, Vic. I don't talk about them very much at all because I don't know which stats they use, and they're not forthcoming about it. I wouldn't call OPS and WHIP advanced stats; they're just standard stats that explain more than the basics. I don't get to hear the announcers except when I'm not at the game.

  • Not making fun of the stats, I just don’t like them, FORTUNATELY wrestling doesn’t have to do anything with stats, win or lose, no cookie cutter athletes, go with guys strong points, it’s almost all an eye test, I like eye tests & value your opinion, I’m familiar with both the extra stats you mention from playing fantasy baseball, I just don’t need a lot of stats, again, my opinion, but I love the eye test, thanks Rich...go O’s...

  • I'm offering Ramon Urias in trade for any one of the players you listed. You name which one. Do you take the deal?

    • BRR, though I love Brett Cumberland as a switching hitting catcher who looks like a doleful lumberjack, I would trade Ramon Urias straight up for Brett Cumberland, but only after a heart felt, sincere farewell dinner with him and his family...

      It may surprise you, but over the last six games Ramon Urias is slashing

      0.333 0.444 0.400 0.844

      That's batting average, followed by on base percentage, followed by slugging percentage, followed by OPS which is on base percentage + slugging percentage. FanGraphs also list Ramon as the Orioles top fielding 2B. I want the Orioles to field the best players they have in their organization without risking a temporarily struggling player to a waiver claim. I think I have a lot more patience with struggling players than most BB commenters as shown be my unwavering support for Urias and Severino.

      The Orioles need to get Severino and Franco out of their prolonged slumps.

      For the record, I am a math major, so yes, major stats geek, but old fart as well (57). I did coach baseball at the high school level for three years (one at JV, two at varsity), hitting and outfield coach, but before the upward launch angle approach to hitting - we actually used a device the forced a short downward path to the ball and another device that developed a balanced swing vs. a King-Kong, twist yourself into a cork screw, while swinging for the fences swing.

      92.5% human, 7.5% robot!

  • I just threw up a lil bit in my mouth, ahhh...NO....LOL....go O’s...

  • I think you meant to say may not care for them...go O’s...

• Stats can be interesting and informative if they corroborate or question observations of the game. Two stats I like are height and weight, but they are hardly ever published although for us televiewers the saying holds that everybody is the same size on television (radio, even more so). Like all sports, baseball is primarily physical, and size, as they say, matters. Secondly, I don't care much for OPS; I think exceptional singles hitters and sluggers have different skills worth keeping distinct. Finally, I find people using stats in discussions or arguments as facts. Opinions expressed numerically are still opinions and not probative. Almost all baseball stats, even the counting ones, are founded on someone's judgment --ball or strike, hit or error, wild pitch or passed ball, etc. Further developed, the basic stats are massaged according to somebody's opinion of how important that stat is in evaluating a player or team. Ironically, the most important and verifiable stat, wins and losses, is, on the record, as of no interest to the current major league team in Baltimore. Like it or not, though, stats are a part of baseball, and I thank Rich for providing those he does because I think he features them judiciously. But that's just my opinion.

  • Tony Gwynn would agree, god bless him...go O’s...

  • Your 3rd to last sentence ... the one that starts with the word "Ironicly" ... says it all WM. I wish I had written that.

  • Batting average has a weak correlation to winning percentage, while on-base percentage, slugging percentage, and OPS, which is just on-base and slugging percentages added together, all have a strong correlation to winning percentage. OPS and WHIP predict winning percentage very well, those are two very telling stats.

    Not sure there are too many exceptional singles hitters any more.

    I actually think Hyde is trying hard to win games this season.

• I agree - generally the more players you have with high OPS, the more runs you score and generally the more pitchers you have with low WHIP, the fewer runs you allow. This translates into more Ws, the result all of us Os fans and thirsting for

  • I generally agree with you, and I'm not being sarcastic. But I think the excitement, interest, and drama of sports come from the particular, not the general. From, for example, the team that over a season or series scores fewer points or runs than the opposition, yet manages to win a championship. In the seven-game Mazeroski World Series, the Yankees obliterated the Pirates in the three games they won, but the Pirates eked out four wins to take the Series. (Yes, I am biased and take special pleasure in seeing the Stripers lose.) And the percentages and the odds are constantly changing; every play is replete with data from many aspects and at many depths. i think part of our discussion is about how deep in the weeds we want to go with different data, something that I think suits different temperaments differently. Knowing the physics of sound enhances listening to music for some people; for others, not so much.

• We keep hearing about the great development of pitchers by the Elias regime. But which young pitcher has really proven himself at the major league level other than Means? They MAY be big time successes and I hope they do well. But let's wait for their major league success before we praise Elias for their development,
  BTW - The Astros traded for or signed as free agents Verlander, Garrett Cole and Greinke. Why if their minor league pitchers were such studs?

• I don't know whether Elias is a genius or not, too early to tell. I do know that the team that Duquette put together to win now, lost more games in a season than any in the history of the franchise. His approach left the organization devoid of IFs, except 1B. Elias' unwillingness to field a major league IF, especially defensively, is abysmal. He has failed in grasping that investment also needs to be in the fanbase. That shortcoming may well cost him his job. Baltimore is not Houston or Miami, where baseball has never been a big deal. It is important to execute the fundamentals, even in the front office. It was Dan's undoing, may be Elias' too. Believing you're the smartest guy in the room is not sustainable.